I have MUCH TO SAY about the investigation… unfortunately I have not had time to put all my thoughts together into something that resembles a ‘cohesive’ post.
I know what you are thinking… “Steve! That never stopped you before!!” Â ;)
If you are unaware of this site’s investigation… “Click Here” but in brief, my ‘diabetic nutritional chart‘ , my ‘diabetic food posts‘ and even  my ‘diabetic menu‘ has been deemed to be ‘nutritional counseling’ and I am being told that is against the laws of NC.
I am being asked to change it and if I do not, I was told an court injunction would result… and I would be taken to court.
Investigation Update
While I contact attorneys and legal aid groups today (and try to respond to the outpouring of support) I just wanted to update those interested as to where things stand right now.
1) The Jimmy Moore (8 min) interview. Â I mention the 8 mins… so you’ll know it’s not 60+ mins. Â You can get in… listen to it and get out…. quickly. :) Â MANY THANKS TO JIMMY for allowing me to share my story!
2) Â Contact North Carolina Board of Dietetics and NutritionistsÂ
Jimmy Moore and others have asked “What can we do to help?” Â I haven’t had a good answer for that frankly.
Thanks to Suzanne Garrett who suggested contacting the North Carolina group…
What a wonderful IDEA! :) … Thanks Suzanne!
Here is the email address … Â Â info@ncbdn.org
PLEASE let them know what you think! :)
3) I have been in contact with several attorneys and firms… so thank you for all of your comments, suggestions and best wishes. :)
Hopefully by this evening, I will have a much firmer grasp on ‘where this stands’.
Sincerely,
Steve Cooksey :)
I was going to suggest IJ, but I saw someone did on your last post. I hope they can help you!
Thank you… I have contacted them. :)
You might also contact Mountain States Legal Foundation. They are working on a similar case pro bono in Texas: http://archive.recapthelaw.org/txwd/522366/
Thank you for the referral! :)
The Institute for Justice was also the first thought I had, but the mention in another post of Rush Limbaugh made me think that the best approach – cheaper and faster — would be to get the attention of one or more of the “right wing media” — Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity, O’Reilly, etc.
Bureaucrats don’t like getting beat in court, but they’re generally terrified of being embarrassed by public exposure. Judging by the number of pingbacks and references from other sites you’re getting (I head about this on the Fat Head movie blog), it’s worthy of the big boys’ attention.
Cheers,
JN
Thanks Jerry… and a great point. I can see both left and right leaning groups/persons having an interest. On other social media sites I’ve used the hashtag #OccupyNutrition.
Once I have an attorney, I’ll set a course of action and I fully expect to contact all those people you mentioned and more. Hopefully they will listen. Thanks again. :)
Steve, heard about your situation on LLVLC. I’m not a lawyer but I’ve spent years reading, interpreting regulations and dealing with regulators. Looking at the regulations you posted I think you’re probably offside… but don’t panic it’s probably not all that serious.
Speaking with cousel is a good idea and so is the good faith cooperation and compliance you are showing. Your focus should be on how you can do 80% of what you want and not on the 20% you can’t do.
The regs carve out some pretty broad areas and some careful planning and advice will help you figure out the right path through it. Their focus seems to be on the personal 1:1 counseling … There are many books published that provide dietary ‘advice’ which don’t appear to raise their ire. There may be a clue there.
Regardless of any personal feeling we may have about a profession be it doctor, lawyer, or dietician they are regulated for a reason and you probably won’t win a fight that says you should be able to practice any profession without a license even if you don’t agree with the advice they are providing(I don’t agree with them either). Having dealt with stuff like this before I’d like to save you a lot of time effort, heart ache and expense.
I would avoid a frontal assault particularly in areas where you may be vulnerable in terms of compliance.
You have my best wishes and feel free to call on me if I can be of help.
Thank you Rob, I do appreciate the advice but playing devil’s advocate….
You offered me advice in a legal matter…. how is that any different than me telling people to eat ‘mostly meats and veggies’. Or … “if your blood sugars are high, reduce carbohydrates”. That is NOT medical advice, it’s not nutritional advice (in my mind) … it’s common sense. It’s like saying, ‘if you are not getting enough oxygen… breath more”. Or … if you feel thristy … drink water.
…thanks… this is inspiration for another blog post. :)
Couldn’t you just put an automatic disclaimer on the footer of all of your posts that states:
“The author of this blog offers his personal opinion and experiences and is not, and never has been, a medical professional nor dietician. The dietary opinions included on this site are for educational or entertainment purposes only. It is not intended nor implied to be a substitute for professional medical or dietary advice. The reader should always consult his or her healthcare provider to determine the appropriateness of the information for their own situation or if they have any questions regarding a medical condition, treatment plan or dietary menu.”
Having spent over a decade as a “licensed professional” and blogger (who gave advice,) I’m pretty darn certain that the laws regarding licensed individuals only apply to those who hold that license. Anyone else can only get in trouble for practicing WITHOUT a license or fraud. So, as an unlicensed individual, they really cannot hold you to the same rules as licensed professionals – only keep you from practicing without a license.
If you make it VERY clear on your posts that you are NOT a licensed professional and giving just your personal opinion and experiences NOT actual medical advice without a license; nor trying to fraudulently claim you ARE a licensed practitioner, I cannot see how they have any further jurisdiction over you and an unlicensed individual relating personal experiences and opinions.
I’m not a lawyer and this is not legal advice – just a personal opinion and friendly suggestion to get a disclaimer up ASAP. ;)
The director in a phone call and in their review document made it very clear. I am violating state law/regulations when I give nutritional advice… period.
The review document is located at the bottom of this post. https://www.diabetes-warrior.net/2012/01/28/this-site-free-speech-are-being-investigated/
Oh – and I did see your disclaimer page, but from my understanding, you really need disclaimers in EVERY post and on the bottom of EVERY page.
Thank you …that is something other’s have suggested. I would of course be willing to do that.
I will proudly say… I am not a doctor, dietitian nor nutritionist… in fact I have not medical training of any kind.
If I can figure this out so should they… if it wasn’t for their …
A) Intellectual Laziness
B) Willful ignorance
C) Greed
D) All of the Above :)
… the main reason I have not??? … Not sure how… But you have reminded me of the need to do that. Thanks :)
Steve. This is astounding. You are not a bottle of pills, an herb promising remedy or unhomogenized milk, though all of those things can be good!
I am not providing advice – only support (lest you sue me ;>)
Seriously this is some sick stuff. I plead with you as a fellow freedom lover – stand strong, keeping your self safe and balancing that with the best fight and as much risk as you can handle. God speed.
Thank you VERY MUCH for those words John. I am standing strong … thanks to the support of people LIKE YOU!!!
I am planning to fight sir. :)
I am new hear and just read about your plight from another blogger. I am aghast at what this agency is trying to pull. I just wrote a long winded email to this agency and copied to the governor of NC as well. I think if this case disturbs you then you should do as I have done. Make them hear how unhappy you are about this whole mess.
Many times when I have worked on public projects that were insurmountable politicians and agencies would reconsider if there was enough push back from constituents. There are tons of laws on the books but agencies have only so much money and resources and they have to pick their battles on what they want to enforce. The more folks that send them long winded emails and letters and calls the better.
Send them to your local and state politicians. Let them know the shenanigans this agency is trying to pull off here. Let them know about your experiences with Paleo and it is not some fad diet but cite them research.
How many of you have gone to certified docs and dieticians only to walk away with no and bad diet advise? Does certification guarantee results or effectiveness or safety? No. How many of you been harmed by such “certified” advise? I know I have. This is really a can of worms when you start peeling the onion and really I don’t think little old NC wants to set a precedent for this whole thing if they lose big time with this.
I personally don’t want back water politicians and agencies from NC telling me in Washington State what diets I can read about. How many times has the science this agency follow been wrong? Lots. Should we sue this agency and all it’s members over all the bad science they have provided the pubic on saturated fat and cite Harvards recent research? Since we won’t know what our genetic tolerances and intolerances are for decades then aren’t they kind of guessing too? One size or diet doesn’t fit all. For Steve this works, for you it might or might not. Buyer be ware has always been the rule online. Duh. They need to switch staff from this agency over to a fraud and scam agency where they will actually catch bad guys.
How far are they going to take this? Are they going to enforce the water cooler talk about diet next? I am sorry but once you go Paleo you look and feel much better and hey people are going to ask and they want to know what you are doing and how did you did it. The Paleo genie is already out of the bottle and there is countless research to support this. He is doing no harm. They really need to nail sneaky old Paula Deen about what she advises with her cooking. Bourdain was right she is the most dangerous woman in America.
You would think this agency would be more focused on bigger issues during these hard economic times and perhaps their budget needs to be cut since they have so much extra time on their hands harassing folks who are not advocating drinking drano but a viable diet that works. Lots of budgets are on the chopping block. Make you local politicians aware you want this agency reined in. They are blatantly wasting tax payers money.
It does beg the question who is pushing this and what is their beef. Is it deep pockets of industries that would be impacted by Paleo? Dieticians that see that we don’t need them that much because this diet is so simple? Big agra? Big processed food? Big pharma? Big Healthcare? I can see a lot of industries that would be majorly impacted negatively on profits if we all went Paleo and got healthier.
I would get on local tv and newspapers too to explain how ridiculous this agency acts. I think Steve is a poster child of how well it works and seeing is believing. He doesn’t even have to say much just stand there and show his before picture.
I hope attorneys get on the band wagon and maybe decide to make this a place where Paleo is forced to become legit with regulators so guys like Steve don’t have to be the ones informing the public. I have spoke with several dieticians around the country and they fear for their jobs to even mention this diet to patients even though they know it works. We need to let these dieticians come out of the closet and offering Paleo as an option without retaliation from closed minded agencies like in NC. Start calling and emailing folks. If you wait for others to do it…well it never gets done.
Great advice and I can promise you this… I vow to fight this. I want to take this to court. I don’t want this to ‘go away’.
As others have pointed out… this is NOT just NC, VA just granted it’s state a delay until 2013 but similar laws are being pushed in Hawaii, NJ, WVa and Colorado. All the best my friend.
Send the emails and letters to NC politicians and if you are a NC resident.
One more thing….the standard of care is out dated and that is what docs and the rest of them like to fall back to. I am sick to death to hear that docs aren’t trained in nutrition giving themselves a overly convenient way to just use pills instead of offering the Paleo diet as a viable option to many health issues. I think this is negligent myself. If there is the science to back this up out there, which there is, and docs still choose old ways, then well the standard of care is wrong. What that agency is pushing is wrong. What they certify is wrong. What they do is wrong. I would have tons more respect for such an agency if they provided Paleo information but they don’t so until they do we need guys like Steve to share their stories that there are options out there. To suppress progress and truth is unAmerican.
Could not agree more and I feel your frustration. I vow to fight this to the very end… thank you. :)
I suggest you simply read that guideline pdf you posted in the other blog entry. It tells you everything you need to know. And the review you posted shows what they think you are doing wrong. Stop giving personal “advice” to specific questions, etc. And always tell people you are not a dietician and this is not medical advice, etc. What people do in regards to all licensed professions when they are not licensed is to respond with your OPINION clearly stated as such. i.e. “What I would do if I were in your situation”, etc. Use phrases such as “I cannot give you advice, but what works for me in such a situation…”
This whole rediculous racket exists simply because this industry paid enough legislators to get them to pass “rules” to protect their business. The ONLY purpose is to force people to PURCHASE a license from the state, so the state can get a piece of the action.
I would suggest you play the politics game with them, tell them you will make necessary changes, appologize for the misunderstaning, tell them you read their regulations and will do all that is in your power to comply, make them feel important, and carry on with what you do. Just avoid “giving advice” to specific questions. For instance, in the spirit of shoving beuracracy up their behinds, take people’s specific questions by way of private emails sent to you, and then write a blog post discussing questions asked “in a general manner”, such as “I was thinking about x situation, and in my opinon if I had this situation come up for me, I would do such-and-so. Remember, I’m no doctor, and I can’t give advice. If you need specific diabetic advice, consult a licensed dietician.” Again, read their guideline document carefully, and make sure you fit into all their loopholes and dodge all the traps that they carefully warn you about.
This kind of crap makes me so angry. What would happen if all the webmasters united and paid off legislators? “No unlicensed person shall create websites”. Instant prosperity for one group. Excellent return on investment. Bribery is good for business. Your legislators are for sale – just look up the stats for who was paid how many millions during the recent SOPA fiasco. Government has become a tool that people with money wield against their competitors. Government is the most lawless band of privateers ever to exist on earth. Makes pirates and mafia types look like saints.
— Government is the only terrorists you will ever have to worry about in America —
Sincere thanks for the comment. Everyone I receive, the person thought enough about me, the blog or ‘the cause” to take the time to respond.
“I suggest you simply read that guideline pdf you posted in the other blog entry. It tells you everything you need to know. And the review you posted shows what they think you are doing wrong.”
I could indeed take your advice … and who knows, I may actually be forced to do that. However, I did not ‘ask’ for this investigation nor the results… I now look at this as an opportunity to:
a) Attempt to expose the ‘monopolizing of nutrition’ for what it really is… a scam bought and paid for by Big Pharma, Big Food and Monsanto.
b) Attempt to publicize even more governmental restrictions on free speech.
c) Last but not least… Publicize the two outcomes of ‘carb up, shoot up’ vs ‘low carb paleo’ as a diabetes treatment plan.
So while I sincerely appreciate the advice and support…. I’m taking a stand. :)
Hi Steve
I am not a citizen of the US, but am familiar with your Constitution and Bill of Rights. And being English am also familiar with the language in which they are written.
The third article in the Bull of Rights gives you the right to free speech. There is no ambiguity about this as far as I can see. And the Constitution, which includes the Bill of Rights was ratified by North Carolina on November 21, 1789.
Therefore, what right does NC have, under the Constitution, to question your right to free speech? I don’t see that you have a case to answer.
Incidentally, I don’t know where you live – if it’s in NC, that might be problem – but if they can harass you because your ISP is in NC and you don’t want the bother of fighting NC, just change ISP to one in another state – or country.
Best wishes for a successful outcome from someone in the same line of information dissemination.
Barry Groves
Yesterday I just watched Jesse on local talk show. He was a past Biggest Loser contestant along with his obese son. Here is a little bit about them:
http://www.nbc.com/the-biggest-loser/contestants/jesse/
One of the comments that Jesse made yesterday on that talk show that stood out for me is… he said that one of the first things the show did was to take him off him diabetes drugs. Which I think he found surprising. He said he was pre-diabetic and was on some sort of pills.
Jesse had decided to go on the how after watching another contestant inspire him. Jesse now wants to inspire others. He also mentions how important exercise was in this. He also goes around and tells folks about his experience. Maybe the NC dieticians should make sure to slap the Biggest Loser contestants with lawsuits if they dare go on local tv and talk about their experiences. The NBC affiliate there should be given the heads up on this one.
This made me think of your site. Here you are Steve trying to inspire others to get healthier and to get off the diabetic meds too. You also explain how you did it much like Jesse does. Because Jesse was on a tv show there was not the time to go into much detail but here at this blog you are able to break it down for folks. The local show Jesse was on was not even an NBC affiliate. All NC local stations should be concerned that anyone who wants to tell their weight loss story on their shows may get slapped by a lawsuit in NC. This is why you ought to get on tv locally and make the case. Nothing ticks off the media more than free speech topics. Don’t forget the newspapers and magazines.
Years ago I was inspired by the Biggest Loser and tried to go on their web site to find out what the contestants actually ate. Turned out they wanted to charge for this information. I decided it was more about selling stuff then actually helping folks. I haven’t watched the show since.
So much of that online where they are just trying to sell something. So much snake oil out there online. That is what confuses me about NC dieticians group since there are sooooo many others sites to go after and they decide to single you site out which is tons better than the rest. It makes no sense.
Many people can’t afford to go to doctors much or a dietician and plus even if they did go they would never hear about Paleo either. No way to walk in emergency room and say hey this is an emergency I know I don’t have insurance but I am obese and I need some help asap. So folks turn to the internet in the interim. I also think many like me are so fed up with the information we have gotten from docs and dieticians in the past they really are so behind in their thinking that they are the last ones I would seek help from. I have tried them in the past and walked away with little info. I recall going to this dietician who was weekly featured on this local news program. I figured this woman would know what I needed to do. I go there and they draw my blood and then later we go over the results. She says to me who is overweight that my zinc is low and that was it. Didn’t say how much zinc I should take or why it was low. I walked out of there shaking my head that I will never play that worthless game again. She was registered too and on tv every week to so she had to be decent.I spent a pretty penny taking those blood test and paying her consulting fees and it really was a total waste of my time and money. I think more and more folks feel this way from what I have heard. Not even the dieticians like the fact they can’t promote Paleo since they would lose their jobs even though they do it themselves and know it works. Even the young dieticians are not being trained with this new science either. They are shocked to learn about Paleo online or in books but not as part of the nutrition education.
I also watched this show about Detroit where so many are obese because there are no groceries stores in the downtown area and folks were stuck with buying crappy food from little corner stores. The crime was so high that most businesses left and the ones that stayed had an impossible time getting insurance. The obesity in that area was sky high along with countless health issues. What you are exposed to does impact your health. There a lots of places like this around the U.S. That explains Detroit but what about the affluent suburbs? They have the grocery stores and still have the same health issues.
That city is starting to turn around with a lots of help. Government agencies are getting involved and it is costly to try to right the wrongs. Diabetes from obesity countless other health conditions are going to cost tax payers a lot of money as the numbers of obese continue to escalate. Can we afford this now? Not hardly.
I bet there are a few places in NC that need intense interventions like this rather than wasting time bullying you. Folks like your self who are inspiring others to change their eating behaviors etc are doing ALL tax payers a big favor in the long term.
What we have been told by the FDA and dietetic regulatory agencies is not working. The problem of diabetes has only continued to sky rocked. It is an epidemic. It is not working. They refuse to admit their part in it and are so busy pointing fingers to take the heat off themselves. “The culprit is that guy online, yeah Steve is what is causing us so much harm.” NOT!
The new paradigm of Paleo gets folks to make a clean break from processed foods and this is one the main reasons the old way doesn’t work. They still try to make it work with processed foods. Once you take them off the table literally then you can actually begin the recovery process. The old way still pushes grains and this just will not work.
People are going to share their weight loss success whether or not the NC dieticians like it or not. It will happen online from so many places.It will happen at work, it will happen on the bus, it will happen on the phone, it will happen at the hair dresser, it will happen ______. It is my understanding that law enforcement has to prove that they are applying the law to everyone equally. So are they doing that will all the folks who are sharing offline around the water cooler? It is my understanding that verbal contracts also are binding so are verbal talks around the water cooler just as damaging? How can they single you out for talking about this online? Just easier to spot and to make an example of. They want to hang you high in the town square for everyone to see to keep the others in line.
What is surprising is that dieticians do not actually offer Paleo as a viable option. With so much science on Paleo it is clear meat and vegetable are a healthy diet. It would be wonderful to actually cross examine their experts on what is considered healthy? What diets are healthy? Based on what science? It would be very satisfying to watch this on court tv to see them try to answer this. How about those school lunches they oversee which they give a stamp of approval? How can they be healthy? Get them to explain that they don’t even know what individuals food tolerances and intolerances are when they do make recommendations since that DNA information has yet to be discovered. That means everyone is still guessing and the only person who can actually figure it out is YOU. Your website helps them do that.
No doc will ever take the time to figure out all your food intolerances nor will a dietician either. They will take your money and smile and pretend they can. Would this be considered fraud?
We need to have a court case like in Inherit the Wind and an attorney like Spencer Tracy making the case for evolutionary nutrition. Didn’t that court case the movie depicted take place in the South? Maybe this evolutionary nutrition idea is not taking hold there due to religious prejudices much like what happened to evolutionary science in schools? What a can of worms these dieticians opened up.
I would love to have an attorney cross examine the very nice Director of the Agency on much of this. I bet she stops smiling and drops the pleasant demeanor very quickly. This agency needs to be reigned in big time.